Meeting Summary 2/28/07
PARK AND RECREATION ADVISORY BOARD
NEENAH CREEK MASTER PLAN PUBLIC HEARING
City Hall Council Chambers Members Present:
Sonja Berg, Kurt Franke, Mary Gruenes, William Justin, Austin Lee, Sandra Maselter, Linda Podvin
Youth Commission Members Present:
None
City Staff Present:
Prentiss Foster, Matt Glaesman, Gayle Minor, Scott Zlotnik, Jessica Schaefer, Recording Secretary.
The staff from SEH presented the Master Plan for Neenah Creek Regional Park.
Chairperson Franke called the Public Hearing to order at 7:10 PM.
Zlotnik reviewed the format of the Public Hearing, and the board agreed that questions would be answered as they are asked, and that the public’s comments are limited to 2 minutes each. |
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Steve Zinsli
Nordic Ski Club Member
711 5th Avenue North
St Cloud MN 56303
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Would like to see it go ahead with a minimum of development. Would like to see it kept in a natural statewith ski/walking trails. Some would like to seemore developed areas, with drive through parkway, which is a legitimate use. He is opposed to the Fire Station, the land was bought as park land, and sneaking a fire station in is inappropriate use of the land. |
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Lowell Olson
St Cloud Area Environment Council
23 Pandolfo Place
St Cloud MN 56303
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Offered several points:
1. The environmental feature, i.e. woods in the northeast corner is being preserved – we like that.
2. Buffering for Neenah Creek proper is adequate.
3. The wetland to the west would rejuvenate if drainage ditches were removed. This would act as a rain garden/filter.
4. Park land should be used for park purposes, not for city
Pubic Works or Fire Department facilities. The city has money to buy land for these other uses.
5. The adjoining School District 742 property should be acquired and added to the park because of the creek and environmentally sensitive areas of this property.
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Eric Bacher
3175 38th Street South
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Lives on five acres by Neenah Creek. He is opposed to plans C and D. It was their understanding when purchasing their home that the park land would be green space and trails. He is upset the correct plans were not on the City website when promised. He feels that the City is trying to claim his private driveway, and it is unnecessary. He feels having soccer fields do not preserve green space. The Fire Station and Public Works building were not on the community development plan. The Fire Station will be on 75 already, and other locations should be explored. He doesn’t want to listen to loud trucks, sirens, and doesn’t want large equipment by children playing in the park. Also is concerned about lighting, bituminous trails, traffic, and parking. Wants to work with us but wants to protect his property and rights. Eliminate the Fire Station and Public Works Building, and don’t take private property for future public access.
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Gene Molden
3922 Co Rd 136
St Cloud MN 56301
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Concerned about the lack of participation in planning by the neighbors--they were not contacted--since they were
in the area first. They want to work with us; they understand growth and that the park should benefit many, but have the least impact on those there first. He is opposed to the Fire Station and Public Works buildings and believes the land should be used only as park land.
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Kim Hellier
3455 Bonnevile Ct |
She is opposed to the Fire Station on site. She also opposed the Fire Station at Plum Creek Park. Many years ago, there was a plan to put a station in Riverside Park, and it was relocated to Talahi. No one regrets that move. Get the Fire Station out of there, and make an ordinance keeping stations out of parks.
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Julie Hiemenz
Pres., League of Women Voters
25 Riverside Drive NE
St Cloud MN 56304 |
Support acquisition of park land for needs. City has acquired several large areas and has proposed Master
Plans. Neenah Creek appears to provide a good mix ofrecreational opportunities along with protection of natural
Resources. Suggests city commit to purchasing ISD 742 land now. Master Plan should include it. Retain land for park and recreation; oppose non park facilities. Fire Station and Public Works building should be located elsewhere.
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Ellen Heneghan
Natural Parks and Trails Coal.
1807 Woodland Road
St Cloud MN 56304 |
Many good features; protects the woods and creek, provides opportunities for active sports and rec, and trails. For most part, consistent with plan when acquired in 1999. Recommend one addition, one deletion.
- Add 70 acre property owned by ISD 742.
- Delete Fire Station and Public Works Building.
Not appropriate in a park plan.
The ISD 742 property is the “jewel of the crown” of this park. Acquisition of this land was a high priority for sales tax money in 2002. One Million Dollars were earmarked, but owners were not willing to sell at that time. Could work with Trust for Public Land until money is available, and could qualify for grants. Asked that the Board endorse Council Member Landy’s motion to include the ISD 742 land. Regarding the Fire Station, same concerns they had with the River Bluffs Park. Park land should be used for Park and Recreation facilities only. If land is used for non-park purpose, other land should be purchased to add to park. There was controversy about the Fire Station and Public Works buildings in the planning process. Feel very strongly Fire Station should not be part of the process. Points should be put into the plan now, or completion and acceptance of the plan should be delayed.
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Judy Dorn
708 14th Avenue South
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Supports the policies just recommended. Has been part of the Healthy Neighborhood Coalition, and is troubled the neighbors around Neenah Creek were not included in the process.
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Colleen Kelly
3835 40th Street South
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Believes that they do need a park. However, when you buy a house, you look for crime rate. This area is currently at a -7%, and the area that has the highest crime rate, 14.4% has three big parks in it. What would make you move there? By bringing parks in, you bring in drugs, having affairs. Would never have kids live by crime ridden areas. They need parks, but not like this. Keep it more natural, and move it in slowly.
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Joe Kustritz
3840 Co Rd 136
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Lives across the road from the park. Others have expressed dissatisfaction with the Fire Station. Solution
where station should be: potential road construction down 33rd, there is open land and utilities. Fire Station #7 belongs north of 33rd. Infrastructure there, proposed intersection with Hwy 15, and proposed bridge across river. Gives fire personnel ability to get all those directions. Prefers to have drive truncated in park, rather than go all the way through. Bituminous trails do not belong in this setting, bark trails would be better. Solution to some problems would be to develop parts on the north and leave the south natural.
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Eve Wallinga
Sierra Club Conservation Co Chair
3123 Alder Lane
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Park was intended to include the School District’s land originally. Most picturesque section of Neenah Creek.
Sales tax money was allocated, but there was no willing seller. District is now ready to sell. Voters wishes should be respected. A pre-set percentage of the sales tax revenue was to go for sensitive land purchase, but has not. Due to long term planning, now is the time to buy it, with grants, and before prices climb. Recommend that it be spelled out in this Master Plan. Much effort has gone into make sure a Fire Station is part of the plan, but none has gone into buying this part of the property. The school district could develop it, removing the possibility that it could become part of the park. Previous administrations thought it would be safe until the city could purchase it. They have been assured that if someone did purchase it, the city could make it impossible for anyone to develop it. Park land is difficult to come by. Should not be used for whatever non park use each administration chooses. Please do not endorse this plan unless it includes the purchase of the ISD 742 property and does not include non park uses for park land.
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Mike Larky
4618 33rd Street South
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Property is in Northwest corner. Echo the concerns heard. Offer one solution regarding fire station and developed areas. Had in mind something more like Quarry Park. Appreciates the idea of soccer fields, etc, but maybe fewer. Like to see Fire Station and Public works buildings somewhere more noisy than this quiet neighborhood. Makes sense to have it somewhere less residential. Open commercial lots are available along Hwy 15. Hate to bring opposition to a process that is intended to be positive and incorporate public input, would like to have more of a positive spirit. Maybe could work together, have more time to absorb and give feedback and have more of a win-win situation.
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Deb Sjogren
3731 Co Rd 136
St Cloud MN 5630 |
Reiterate that Public Works and Fire Station has no place in a public park, does not fit. Has had experience near the downtown Fire Station, the paging system and sirens just will not fit into this neighborhood. The neighbors would have appreciated being asked to be on the task force. Bituminous trails should be more natural instead, likes suggestion of minimal use of baseball and soccer fields. Can always expand in the future. Issue not looked at, accident rate in Co Rd 136. Raised 1 ½ foot, have had multiple rollovers into their yard. If more traffic, need to look at that issue.
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Gary Wallinga
3123 Alder Lane
St Cloud MN 5630 |
Refresh memory about St Cloud’s past. 10/13/87 article “Hot Issue: Planned Riverside Fire Station has Some Residents Steaming.” Read article about plan to build fire station in Riverside Park. Fire station ended up on property on School property instead. Then in 2006 Fire Station was approved for River Bluffs Regional Park, and voted because would not set a precedent, however this is again the plan, for both a Fire Station and Public Works building, and they had also heard that a 20 acre training facility would be placed at the next fire station – wouldn’t that be Neenah Creek? Slippery slope thinking, and they need to draw a line. Using park land for purposes other than what was intended is bad public policy. Don’t approve this plan with the fire station and public works buildings.
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Sherry Lahr
3803 Co Rd 136
St Cloud MN 56303 |
House is right next to the proposed maintenance building. Here to echo concerns of neighbors, but to add something that has been missed. Area where Public Works and Fire Station would be is a stand of 70 foot blue spruce, which is not noted on the area topography maps. House is right next to proposed building. Anyone agreeing to this plan would have to agree to look out any window in your house or in the backyard and see a maintenance building. Lived at property before park bought it, were told it was purchased for land preservation. Have a sign outside of St Cloud that says Preserve America, Welcome to St Cloud, a Preserve America Community. This is not preserving. Were told that there would be no tar, not one tree disturbed. Have a hard time believing no trees would be disturbed in this plan. Spoke with the person who sold the City the land, and they said they would have never sold the land had they known this was the plan.
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Tim Schriefels
3863 43rd Avenue South
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Area in North of land, when field was there, there were up
to 55 deer. That field is now a development. Deer have moved to the swamp area. The proposed trails cross the creek, along the brushy areas, and that’s where the deer are bedding down, and pheasants are nesting. Already problems in other parks with over populated deer. South area of park is swampy, is a good area for the deer; thought there was some consideration for the wildlife in that area, but with the fire station there, they will not be comfortable in that area. Opposes the road into the west area. Plan says existing roadway, but it is an easement owned by the property owners. No need for access if not developed. SEH representative seemed pleased with herself when talking about all the groups included in the planning, but finds it appalling that the neighbors were not included.
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Scott Jennings
3824 43rd Avenue South
St Cloud MN 56303 |
Correction regarding 43rd Avenue. It is not a road. Ownsthe property and signed an easement with the other local property owners, not the city. Now calling it access to the park. This is our driveway, we’ve purchased plows and graters, have installed a culvert. Propose a new plan: take property north of camping area and draw an East-West line. Take out Fire Station and Public Works Building, scale down sports fields, put all active recreation to the north, and put natural trails to the south.
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Larry Klein
3670 Plum Creek Drive
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Had 110 acres to the north, and sold City 60 acres for the
park. Agreement that to the East of this property line there would be an accessible trail north to 33rd Street and through some of the meetings, nothing has come through. Just wants to make sure this is included, to tie into bikeways or trails parallel to 33rd street for access into the park.
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Gene Molden
3922 Co Rd 136
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Is there a concept E? Maybe if not, it is due. We candevelop land, tear down buildings, but we can only preserve lands one time.
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Paul Schwinghammer
3135 Co Rd 136
St Cloud MN 56303 |
Own property just North of 33rd Street. Discussed with
Zlotnik would like to see more access to the park from 33rd.
Trails should continue north of 33rd. Stone Gate should have access, there will be trails throughout the development. With 33rd becoming a 4 lane, there should be plans as to how people will cross. Heard the Wallinga’s, compliment them for working on this. High value wetlands north of 33rd. Plan for Stone Gate, there is a wildlife corridor, goes right through ISD 742 property, and that is why people are so adamant to get that land. Wildlife needs a certain amount of acreage to sustain itself.
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Tom O’Brien
2253 Chelmsford Lane
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Area west of property, future public/private development,
with a road, contemplating access to that side. Park
Maintenance Building, shoved off to the side. If it’s a Park building, employees would be in and out on a daily basis. Should be more centrally located, near the warming house area, where the employees could go from a central location. No road to west across the creek. Can’t imagine employees walking when could drive around to west side. Provisions should be made to have a road access to that area. Also, all plans cramming a lot of development on edges by neighbors. Planning talks about spacing between developments, and here we have blacktop right up to the neighbors. Should be more of a nature area, not offensive to the park. Aesthetically pleasing, and more centrally located to maintain the property. Soccer fields should have more spacing from the neighbors so they have a park like experience.
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Franke clarified that this meeting would consist of the open house, presentation by SEH and the Public Hearing. The Plan would then be voted on at the next regular Park and Recreation Board Meeting in April.
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Krista Bacher
3715 38th Street South
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Matt Glaesman had suggested that it would be a possibility
to include some of the neighbors on the park committee,
would that be a possibility?
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Franke stated he is not in charge of the process. Zlotnik asked if she meant on the Park and Recreation Advisory Board. Franke said he felt that this was a resounding theme, and that, like the core neighborhood discussions, neighbors should be included in the process. Not sure what is the next step. Maselter said that anyone could contact any of the Park and Recreation Advisory Board to make their opinions heard, and also that on the City’s website the plans are all available to review. Berg said she thought Bacher was wondering about future meetings, which she said there were no future meetings planned. Bacher stated that Glaesman did suggest that. Glaesman then stepped up and said he did not remember saying that. It is an option, but suggests that the comments are put into writing and that staff will meet with neighbors. Zlotnik stated that his email and SEH’s contact information are on the website. They will consider input and notify them accordingly, Maselter asked Zlotnik to clarify the process after they make their recommendation. Zlotnik stated it is a long process, and that they will take in the comments. They will work with planning, and the consultants. Asked that people contact staff in writing, and if staff or committee has another meeting, staff will contact adjacent land owners. Glaesman asked that comments are in writing because this is beginning of the process for final decision. These are only concepts at this time. There is the Park and Recreation Board decision, then Planning, City Council. Three bodies to hear all of the ideas yet to come. Sit down, take time to write down thoughts, conveying ideas and concerns, and these will be shared with all, and in the meantime perhaps staff could consider written comments, and come back with further concepts. No decisions have been made, this is the first body to have a vote, comments still have full effect.
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Eric Bacher
3715 38th Street South
St Cloud MN 56301 |
Speaking on behalf of everyone here, I live in the center of this area, I spent 8 ½ hours handing out information on this subject to inform everyone. It was amazing no one was informed. Notification should be spread out more than 300 feet; everyone in the area needs to know.
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Franke asked about 300 feet buffer. Zlotnik stated by open meeting law, minimum is just advertisement in the paper; letter is what we did above and beyond what is necessary. There has been council meetings regarding Neenah Creek on Channel 19 four times, advertised in the paper for hiring of consultant, allocation of funds was on Channel 19 in front of City Council. Franke stated that minimum was met and the steps were above and beyond what was necessary. Zlotnik stated that they would have pads at the door, and people could sign up to be contacted, and people at home could contact staff and be added to the list. Maselter motioned to adjourn the Public Hearing, and Gruenes seconded. Meeting was adjourned at 8:22 PM. |
