Turning Public Meetings into Project Momentum

Episode Transcript

Mollie (Host)
Welcome back to {Brief}ly Speaking, the SEH podcast that tackles big topics in the AEC industry with quick expert insights. No fluff, just the essentials. If the phrase public engagement meeting makes you picture tense rooms, tough questions, or a few crossed arms in the back rows, you might not be alone. For agencies, these meetings feel less like collaboration and can sometimes feel like damage control. But here's the truth. When done well, public engagement is one of the most powerful tools a project team has. It can surface risks early, improve designs, build trust, and ultimately lead to better project outcomes. When done poorly, it can derail momentum fast. Joining me today is Kristen Peterson, a senior planner and SEH's lead public involvement specialist, Kristen has led public engagement efforts on more than 130 projects, facilitating both virtual and in-person meetings, guiding design workshops and charrettes, and helping agencies navigate community concerns when emotions can run high. She knows how to translate complex ideas into clear, accessible conversations, and how to keep meetings productive transparent, and credible, even when the answers aren't always easy. So Kristen, welcome to {Brief}ly Speaking.

Kristin (Guest)
Thank you, Mollie. Very happy to be here. Love the topic.

Mollie (Host)
Well, great. You're the perfect person to talk to. So like I kind of said in my intro there, I think one of the first things that comes to mind and might not always be correct, but when we first hear public engagement meeting, sometimes that thought of pushback and complaints is what pops up. So let's start there. How do you reframe these meetings as a tool for better project outcomes and not see it as just a checkbox?

Kristin (Guest)
When I hear that question, I think, how can we avoid that in the first place? So I believe that our clients and the agencies we work with really do understand the value and the importance of getting the engagement right. And it really is because we've seen too often what it looks like when it goes wrong. And we know it can derail a project. We know it can slow it down, it can erode trust, and it can really have a negative impact on a project. So I think the important thing when putting together a plan is to think through what community you're in. what audiences you need to reach, identifying stakeholders and what their communication needs will be, what their issues may be. And even when you've done all that pre-work, really in that first meeting, approaching the public with your listening ears, not approaching them with an agenda that you're trying to push through, but really listening to how they use the project area, what's important to them, what issues they see. and tailoring each engagement or outreach plan to meet the needs of the community and the project that we're working with.

Mollie (Host)
It kind of sounds like you said a lot of that maybe negativity that we can hear about sometimes comes from mistrust or negative past experiences. I also feel like social media plays a trend into it because you never really see the meetings that go well. You see the ones that erupt into chaos and arguments when really It's not like that most of the time.

Kristin (Guest)
I totally agree. I think really the projects that we work on, the teams we work with, everybody really does value public involvement and does take it to heart and does want to do good by the communities that we're serving. And I think you're right, for the most part, people are extremely appreciative of our time and our efforts and going out and listening. But there are meetings that have ended in less productive conversations, or stakeholders who are upset with a particular outcome or approach. So there are ways to mitigate that. But I think the biggest piece is trying to avoid that altogether. And we really see that our clients value that and we're here to help with that.

Mollie (Host)
Yeah, and that leads me right into my next question of avoiding that really starts with, I think you coined the phrase, trust and transparency. So how can project teams intentionally build that transparency into the process from day one so that stakeholders feel confident in both the decisions being made and the people that are making them?

Kristin (Guest)
I think that trust building starts before a project even starts. We see a lot of the cities we work in have spent years, decades building that community relationship between city staff and the communities they serve. And those relationships put you at an advantage when you start a new project. If you had trusted advisors in community groups that you can reach out to at the start of a project, you're already ahead of the game and just as important as building those relationships before a project, understanding that that's going to affect future projects down the line. So maintaining that trust before projects, during projects and setting up future projects for those ongoing relationships is critical.

Mollie (Host)
Kind of in the same vein of trust here, how should project teams think about tailoring their message for different audiences, residents, building owners, elected officials, all while staying truthful? You're talking about really complex projects sometimes, and different groups that might be in attendance or that might have different meetings often have different levels of understanding of that project. So how do you stay truthful while kind of delivering that message in ways that is understandable.

Kristin (Guest)
I think this is the best part of engagement, is to really look deeply at the different stakeholders that are involved in a project and put yourself in their perspective and make engaging as easy as possible. It could be the difference between a community that has a lot of children or youth that you are looking to engage. Or it could be a project where you have large developers and property owners that have large legal teams. So very different message when you're going into a classroom with students versus a corporate environment. And the great news is we have so many tools and so many resources to tailor our messages to wherever we need to be. And I want to talk more about that later, but I think we have a rich toolbox and making sure that before we even start, we're looking at what would be the best way to reach those audiences. And then just as important too is once you've started and you're, you know, maybe 20, 30% into the project, recalibrate, ask the stakeholders, are we meeting your communication expectations? Is there a better way that you would like us to reach out to you or collaborate with you. we've got some business owners that would prefer a one-on-one call, whereas we have other stakeholders that would prefer something completely different like a field walk with staff so that they can share their concerns and ideas.

Related Content: 5 Ways to Engage Stakeholders and Get Your Community Behind a Project

Mollie (Host)
Yeah, I think it's great thinking of the different challenges and how I know you've said to me in the past, this is your favorite part, is you get to solve kind of those situations and figure out which piece of the puzzle fits best for which group. I want you to talk me through your toolboxes, you coined it there, a little bit more. Tell me about the different methods or styles that you use to convey some of these complex projects to different audiences.

Kristin (Guest)
I have one example that pops up immediately, which was the twin ports interchange up in Duluth, Minnesota. This project, I'm not supposed to call it this, but locals affectionately called it the "can of worms" because that's what the highway system looked like on a map. It was very complicated, many roads going over, going under, merging, exiting. And when looking at an engineering set of plans, nearly impossible for even, you know, pretty technically savvy folks to fully understand what was happening. And so one of the favorite tools that we have is our 3D model shop, where we have the use of a laser cutter, 3D printer, and a lot of really great tools where we can make hands-on 3D physical models. So for that project we did, we built a large, almost 6-foot-by-6-foot scale model of the interchange and the proposed changes. And one of my favorite days, one of my favorite photos was listening to the reaction of people at that meeting saying things like, oh, I get it for people who had been going to these meetings for years, not really understanding what was being proposed. But when we presented it in this way, you had children running their finger along the path that cars would take, you know, adults, seniors. It was just, it's such a great way to break down barriers of communication. So we use that 3D model shop quite a bit, and it's one of my favorite tools to use just because it is so broadly understandable. We've had meetings where we had upwards of five non-English languages spoken, and we were able to bring in 3D printed versions of retaining wall patterns, again, where you can touch and feel And without even having a common language, we were able to get the feedback of the community on what they wanted to see their community look like. So seeing a young child with their grandparents and they may not speak the same language, but they can all come together and communicate through these tactile models is really rewarding.

Mollie (Host)
Yeah, and just get their input. And I think that's so cool because, I don't know, in my mind, I still just think of like a PowerPoint on the projector and someone talking and what you're doing is so much different and you're really giving them something tactile that they can hold and turn around and look and really see how the project's going to come together without any questions in their mind. So that's amazing. Switching gears here a little bit, we're going to switch to kind of the client side of things here and how they're thinking through. What is one of the biggest missteps that you've seen either municipalities or agencies make Before the meeting even starts, how can they better prepare to have a successful engagement meeting?

Kristin (Guest)
I think one of the biggest challenges is not only are they trying to serve the community, but they also have to serve the city itself. So our project managers from cities or counties, they have to be accountable to their bosses as well and their internal policies. And so having that understanding of what city policies are or county policies are and really knowing how far you can push those boundaries or not on a project, I think that's a really critical piece. And where we have seen communities want to challenge those policies, we've seen really tough conversations but ended up with really good solutions when there was a lot of understanding on both sides and a flexibility on both sides. And I think that's led to some of the best outcomes out of the most challenging situations.

Mollie (Host)
In some of those challenging situations, I mean, I feel like we've talked about this, I talked about it in the intro and then kind of in our first question there of these type of meetings being synonymous with a little bit of pushback. Not always the case, as we've learned, but If you do get these high emotions or some negativity during the meeting, how do you recommend facilitators handle these situations while still keeping the meeting productive?

Kristin (Guest)
That's always something on my mind. You know, when someone is upset at a meeting or expressing frustration, I try and keep in mind that this is coming from their passion over the topic. This is coming from them caring. And it's a very sincere emotion, and I make sure to carefully listen to not only what they're saying, but kind of the meaning behind what they're saying as well. And you know, going back to that toolbox, sometimes you can anticipate these tough conversations and approach them in a different environment. For example, we're often balancing the needs in transportation between people walking, biking, and driving, as well as the environment itself, you know, drainage and utilities and all these other pieces that we have to fit within our right-of-way and sometimes the folks who are advocating for bike lanes are very loud and organized, but those advocating for maybe accessibility or other considerations are less vocal. So I really like to look at all of the pieces in a project and make sure that we're hearing voices on each of those topics. So there may be loud voices that can dominate the conversation, but we wanna make sure that we're really seeking out the voices that are less comfortable talking in a public environment or giving them one-on-one conversations and meetings or focus groups to elevate all of those perspectives. And then that final piece is reporting back to the public. So very clearly expressing what you heard in a meaningful way. And to me it's so important to logically walk through all the pros and cons from all the different perspectives. And it gets you closer and closer to a compromise that I think people can eventually buy into with transparency in that discussion.

Mollie (Host)
There's a couple of pieces in your answer there that I want to hit on because I think it was really great. I love the idea of, you know, they're there and they're vocal because they're passionate and they care about this project. They care about this specific piece and seeing change in their community. And you listening to them, taking that into consideration, but also not letting it control the room. and still allowing those other opinions and values to have an opportunity to speak. Kind of the people who maybe don't feel as comfortable being outspoken. So having that balance I think is a really great way to approach these situations. or giving people one-on-one time to speak. I know you said that if you can anticipate that it's going to be kind of a problem, maybe talking with them ahead of time and saying, I want to get your opinion on this right away. We know that that's happening. So I think that's a really great way to approach these. The second piece that you brought up was listening. And I think that's really important. I feel like a lot of people who approach public engagement go in and just start talking at the community. and not really necessarily taking that step of listening, which is what this is all about, right? It's all about feedback. So what does genuine listening look like? You've said that earlier. How can teams show that they're hearing the concerns rather than just defending their design?

Kristin (Guest)
Ask questions. You know, I think sometimes when someone feels like they have the answer and they want to convince someone of their answer, that's not the way to approach this. You really have to turn off your own biases and ask them to go deeper, really get at the root of what their concerns are. You know, it may lead you to them describing a car accident or a situation that they were in. where they have these really strong beliefs about one element of a project. And I think building that rapport with them, we're not there to change their minds. We're just there to understand as best as we can their perspective and to carry those pieces into our design. As engineers and planners, we all have a code of ethics that we follow. And I think, you know, keeping that in mind when you go out to the public that you really do have to turn off your biases, and listen to what the concerns are, and then do your best to bring all of that to the table. Then you can put your planning and engineer hat back on and go at it from a more analytical perspective. But building those connections and those relationships with the people you're serving, I think is the only way to get through those challenging conversations.

Mollie (Host)
When you're listening to these, you hear their concerns, you hear their stories. How can feedback that's gathered during these public engagement meetings actually influence project decisions. Does it? Does it really influence it? Do you make changes?

Kristin (Guest)
Absolutely. It happens all the time. It's in our nature to be problem solvers. We want to come up with lists of solutions that could work great, but we really do need to rely on the daily users to find the best match. So we see it just in the smallest of adjustments here and there, understanding a business and how they use their driveway or don't use their driveway can have an enormous effect on a road layout. One of my favorite examples of public feedback changing the course of a project was a city that we were working with knew that the brick streets in this part of town were really significant to the community members. We knew that before the project even started. It came up immediately when we started engaging with the public. And they recognized pretty quickly that this was a much bigger issue than city leadership had anticipated it would be. So they extended the engagement process and then added quite a bit of internal negotiations and discussions and feedbacks, additional meetings with property owners. And in the end, the city went against its own internal policies and is putting brick pavers back in the drive lane of the street. So that was a huge win for the community. That brick was so important to them. And it took a lot of work on the city's behalf to make sure that they had a product that was maintainable, that would last, that would perform well. So it was a true collaboration between the city and the community members to get that brick back into the design of the street. And I'm really excited. We're revealing that back to the public here in just a few days. So I'm looking forward to seeing this process through and delivering a project that the community is really excited about. It's just a great example of this city going the extra mile to deliver the project that the community wants.

Related Content: How a 5-Step Preliminary Design Process Improved a Street Project

Mollie (Host)
I grew up on a street that had a brick section, and so I understand. I loved that. I loved the sound of it when I was going home. I loved the history of it. was an old neighborhood. So I get the passion behind that. So throughout your career, how have you seen public engagement evolve? And then looking ahead, what are your expectations and maybe what should agencies start doing now to stay ahead?

Kristin (Guest)
Love this question. It makes me think back 10, 15 plus years and we would receive an RFP and the title of the RFP would be Engineering Services for Road Project. And then task one would be project management and then buried within that task, there'd be a sentence about stakeholder engagement and public involvement. And then fast forward a few years later, that buried sentence got pulled out to its own task. So now you see project management task one, public engagement task two. But a few years later, we started seeing it pop up in the header of the RFP. So now it's engineering and public engagement services for projects. Even now, just in the last couple of years, we're starting to see it go even further where our clients are realizing how important this is and they do want specialist teams and specialized people leading these engagement efforts. And so now we see engagement as its own RFP that supplements a separate contract for engineering services. So that's what I've seen in terms of just the increased value or understanding of the value of engagement from our clients. And then, you know, it would be impossible not to talk about how engagement has changed without talking about 2020, just the major shift in landscape from going almost entirely in-person engagement to only virtual engagement to now where we are, I think, thriving in a hybrid environment. There's still fantastic value in face-to-face, in-person conversations and meetings, but it's undeniably more convenient and easier to reach people virtually through an online environment. So it's not uncommon for us to suggest both options and see, you know, if you have 50 people at an open house, we usually see 10 times more people engaged online. So 50 people at a meeting and then 500 more or even more than that engaging with our website content or online surveys. Going forward, I think harnessing that technology leap, using new tools that are making it easier for people to leave geospatial comments on maps, making it easier to respond to focused survey questions. And then now we're looking at AI in terms of just maybe this is its own question, but the way we use AI now to understand and comb through feedback that we've gotten has been a game changer. I used to avoid open-ended questions or limit how many open-ended questions we would ask just because of how time consuming it could be to read through responses, catalog their sentiment, and summarize the themes. And, you know, we have surveys where we get upwards of 2000 or 3000 responses. And so going through and summarizing that could take days, maybe a week even to get through all that. And now with the use of AI, we can get a comments and theme summary within seconds that is extremely detailed. And what I like about that is even once you've done an initial summary, you can dig further. So if I see something come up in the initial summary about a theme, I can dig further and say pull all the verbatim quotes about bicycle facilities. Give me all the negative quotes about drainage or water. Show me all the comments about trees. And so it's transformed how we can analyze the information that the public is getting us.

Mollie (Host)
I love the idea of AI moving forward. I mean, it's kind of scary how fast that world is evolving, but it really can be so helpful if used correctly. And I think this is a great example of that. You get a lot more information in those open-ended questions, but it just wasn't feasible for you prior because you couldn't spend the time and cities didn't want to pay for you to spend the time, frankly, to go through and read them all and really understand that. And now you can get that more detailed information and still get that good summary, like you were saying, in a matter of seconds, which is mind-blowing always. So I think that's a great answer for how we're looking ahead at public engagement. That is the end of my questions. Did you have anything else that you wanted to add in the topic of public engagement and your world?

Kristin (Guest)
I will just add that I feel really fortunate to have this role. To be trusted with our resources and our built environment is something that I am very proud of. And I love being in the car and riding around with my kids, and they'll say things like, hey, mom, isn't that your bridge? And I'll say, yes. And granted, I am not a bridge engineer and I didn't build the bridge, but they watched me for sometimes years or even a decade work on a project. So to be able to point to something that we drive by and use and rely on, it feels really good to contribute that way. And we just have such a great team of people who are passionate and care about what we do. And so that makes this an incredibly wonderful job.

Mollie (Host)
I love that. That's such a great way to end here. So to wrap us up here, to take us home, it's clear that public engagement doesn't have to be a headache or a hurdle. When it's done with intention, transparency, and a willingness to actually listen, it becomes one of the most valuable parts of the project. A big thank you to Kristen for sharing your insights on how to prepare and navigate through tough conversations and just use community feedback overall to strengthen project outcomes instead of slowing them down. If you found this episode helpful, be sure to subscribe to {Brief}ly Speaking and check out our other episodes covering the issues shaping the AEC industry today. Thanks for listening and we'll see you next time.

Kristin (Guest)
Thanks, Mollie.